Were you an Immortal Martian Oligarch

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uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
Were you an Immortal Martian Oligarch

...what ought you to do to rid yourselves of the pesky Barsoomian Movement?

Contemplating the sort of underhanded, "secretly support the worst terrorist of them all to sully the entire movement" plot but I am wondering how successful that could be, or what ways would be more effective at crushing the entire mess of rebellion-to-be.

Ideas?

Exhuman, and Humanitarian.

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Discreditation is the best

Discreditation is the best approach.

Employ agents provocateur to infiltrate the Movement and turn up the radicalization. Because the Movement is very loose, this will be easy, even if they have to literally form their own cells and recruit disaffected, angry Martians.

Give these agents carte blanche to plan and carry out actual acts of terrorism in the Movement's name; even authorize them to make severely damaging (but not permanently ego-destroying) attacks on oligarchs themselves, and especially the families. Slaughtered children never fails to play well on the news, especially if they burnt the stacks and attacked the backups. (Fortunately, secondary or tertiary backups went unseen.) Let them make attacks on industrial locations - even vitally critical ones, that everybody on Mars needs intact, such as the Olympus space elevator. Mines, factories, etc, should be targets as well.

Have them ramp up the brutality - not being content to shoot the guards dead, they should inject them with stack-burners and catacinin once their morphs are down, to permanently destroy the ego that was in the morph. They then proceed to liberate the indentures, etc.

The idea being that in the long run, your radicals will turn public opinion so strongly against the Movement that in the end, the only people willing to be known as Barsoomians are those who are so radical that they approve of maximum brutality and the violent brands of anti-corporate anarchy, with your own people in charge of the whole Charlie Foxtrot, and thus, in the know about everything. Then you sweep them all into the orchestra pit in one fell swoop, and look like heroes for ridding Mars of its most dangerous radicals.

Skype and AIM names: Exactly the same as my forum name.

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Bursting Eagern... Bursting Eagerness Soul's picture
Shadow...

Shadow...

How much thought have you put into this kind of thing?

Because that seems a bit elaborate for a 13 minute (maximum) response time.

In other words, firing off a laser with a sufficient TWR for the recoil to be noticeable would require a post-miracle-tech laser weighing less than a disposable plastic spoon and powerful enough to shoot down Death Stars? -- ShadowDragon8685

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Bursting Eagerness Soul wrote

Bursting Eagerness Soul wrote:
Shadow...

How much thought have you put into this kind of thing?

Because that seems a bit elaborate for a 13 minute (maximum) response time.

Honestly none, before I'd read his question. I began by thinking of attempting to arm the more radical members of the Movement with a TITAN superweapon, but then I realized that was the kind of thing that would get Ozma involved, and also the kind of thing which, in all balance of probability, would go horribly right.

Then I remembered the unfortunate fact that police organizations often employ agents provocateur to incite members of organizations to take more radical actions than otherwise they would, so they can be arrested, and in particular one recent event wherein the policemen themselves actually built the devices the organization wound up using in their civil disobedience.

Then I thought, "Okay, and now I'm an immortal gerontocrat who is only obliged to pay lip service to rule of law, in conspiracy with dozens of my fellows, all of similar means and similar lack of restraint. After all, we came to mars specifically so we could be oligarchs without laws restraining us." So then it was natural to turn it all the way up to actually going ahead with full false-flag terrorism operations, operations for which credit was gleefully claimed, to so thoroughly discredit the Movement that only those who were fully radicalized and wanted to see the stack of every corporate executive burnt would willingly associate themselves with the Movement.

Skype and AIM names: Exactly the same as my forum name.

My EP Character Questionnaire
Thread for my Questionnaire
The Five Orange Pips

uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
I am okay with using Ozma to

I am okay with using Ozma to back up the oligarch too.

Exhuman, and Humanitarian.

ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
what shadow pointed out is

what shadow pointed out is not a very new concept. it is actually a very old one and fairly well known. the differences lie in the details and in ep's case the timeline. with EP you could set this in motion for the course of millenia so the changes and radicalizations occur very gradually so no one will notice the changes.

uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
Sure, I kind of already

Sure, I kind of already intend to do the false flag op, my trouble is figuring out specifically how, and what the Barsoomians would do in response to part of their movement acting so radical. A lot of activists nowadays are well aware of police infiltrators and try to counter them, so what are the responses that the Movement would use to counter this, and how could the Oligarchs (or Ozma maybe) neutralize this response?

Wheels within wheels!

Exhuman, and Humanitarian.

ThatWhichNeverWas ThatWhichNeverWas's picture
I've thought about this - my conclusions are hilarious.

There's a reason False Flag ops are a classic: they're an absolute nightmare to counter, and EP tech makes things horrifically complex - specifically Psychosurgery.

For the hostile party, it creates two major possibilities. Firstly, Infiltrators can be custom-formed to be ideologically and behaviorally favorable to the target group, and secondly it means that getting access to a group member or their backup allows them to be turned absolutely.
Moreover, in both cases the subject can be altered so they don't know they're infiltrators.

The options to counter these possibilities are limited. Checking the background of new members, or rechecking those members who gain power within the group is a basic measure, as is regular brainprint and PsyS inspection to search for signs of PsyS intrusion.

A moderately effective measure in finding PsyS altered infiltrators is trying to purposely trigger any behavioral or memory blocks into activating: an example would be having the suspect "purposefully" leak information to the PC - if the suspect is an infiltrator, then the act of leaking information may be covered by the behavioral block, which would show observable behavioral symptoms - they may not be able to comprehend the task, or remember it afterwards.

The real extreme is to use PsyS to enforce loyalty to the group, which would conflict with or counter other conditioning. The extent of the alteration needed to trigger programming conflicts, and so the acceptability and frequency of this tactic's use, is GM fiat*.
Really, the most effective counter for False Flag shenanigans is already in play - the Movement is not a single group, so the effect of an infiltrator or "bad" cell can have is limited.

It's also worth noting that there's nothing stopping the Movement from creating infiltrators either - all the same reasoning applies in both directions.
Taken to the (infinity entertaining) extreme, this means that a given member can at any one moment be absolutely loyal to the PC, absolutely loyal to the Movement, or absolutely loyal to Both at the same time. To get philosophical, in this case the identities of the actual members becomes arbitrary and fluid... and the movement and PC become independent entities.

-----
Come with me on this journey:
Your PC-PCs are employed by A to investigate rumors that a Movement group is planning a "suicide" bombing. His Secretary B asks you to look out for their cousin C, who may have gotten mixed up in things.

Though "methods" they meet the group leader D, along with bodyguards E and F. D lets slip that the bombing is real, but targeted at an illicit TITAN research lab. Inquiries into C reveal that C isn't a member of the Movement.

The PCs meet an agent to pass along what they've learned... only to discover the agent is E(!), who remembers the meeting but has no idea what occurred. Confused, they return to thier employer, but he isn't there... but his partner F is, who has absolutely no idea what's going on.

In order to clear things up, the PCs infiltrate the Cell's HQ, only to find that B is in charge, and C is following thier orders. Confronting them both, it turns out that they both remember the earlier meeting, but B thinks that they were D, and C was F - they remember the request into C's status, but neither of them connects the inquiry with C's identity.

However, they discover that the bomber is in his way to the target, and after escaping begin thier pursuit - arriving just in time to see that the bomber is A, but too late to prevent detonation.

They return to the PC office to report their failure... where they are met by D, who claims to be their employer.

Your players all get massive confusion-based headaches, and you sit back and cackle maniacally.
----

*Lowest boundary - "Subject thinks other movement members have good taste in Hats"

In the past we've had to compensate for weaknesses, finding quick solutions that only benefit a few.
But what if we never need to feel weak or morally conflicted again?

Redroverone Redroverone's picture
I'm more of a dirty player in this regard

Simplest would be a viral hack that shuts down the breathing specifically on a ruster morph, with planetary delivery of the bug via iceteroids, and a quick quick immunization program for your guys combined with genefixing any new rusters that come off the line and a crackdown on reseleeving. Sure, it's a planetary scale genocide, but the opposition won't be able to complain too much when they're all dead.

And edit: Yes, this is horrifically barbaric. So was Caesar lopping the one hand off every single Gaul. Winners still write the history.

The dog ate my signature

uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
ThatWhichNeverWas wrote:There

ThatWhichNeverWas wrote:
There's a reason False Flag ops are a classic: they're an absolute nightmare to counter, and EP tech makes things horrifically complex - specifically Psychosurgery.

...

Wow. That is some PKD level insanity, which is perfect. I had some minor plans to utilize psychosurgery, so now I need to foreshadow a greater level of madness. I am hoping the Firewall book comes out before I get too far along in this semimonthly campaign, as you've given me a dozen new ideas, TWNW.

Redroverone wrote:
Simplest would be a viral hack that shuts down the breathing specifically on a ruster morph, with planetary delivery of the bug via iceteroids, and a quick quick immunization program for your guys combined with genefixing any new rusters that come off the line and a crackdown on reseleeving. Sure, it's a planetary scale genocide, but the opposition won't be able to complain too much when they're all dead.

And edit: Yes, this is horrifically barbaric. So was Caesar lopping the one hand off every single Gaul. Winners still write the history.

The GSP/ruster trouble is ripe for attempted genocides. May need to keep it as a back-up plan for the villain should the Sentinels unravel the False Flag op too much.

Exhuman, and Humanitarian.