How hard is it to grow morphs?

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Scottbert Scottbert's picture
How hard is it to grow morphs?

Years ago, I was under the impression that healing vats and cloning vats just worked on their own. They have Device AIs 'designed to operate the device without transhuman assistance' after all.

2nd edition has made it explicit that this is not the case, at least for anything besides healing -- and looking back at 1st edition, as far as I can tell, rules for skill checks needed for modding or growing morphs weren't given -- so perhaps believing Device AIs could do this was reasonable, back then.

However... It seems now that growing/building a morph is a task action taking weeks or months. And according to page 32, maintaining a task action requires eight hours per day of task. Does this mean that babysitting an exowomb to make sure it doesn't screw up is a full-time job? For each individual morph?

I suppose it would certainly explain the morph shortage, but it also seems like growing clones and assembling pods is something transhumanity would have down pat by now.

Is there something I'm missing, or does every morph-growing facility have to hire someone to watch each tank for eight hours per day?

DivineWrath DivineWrath's picture
I haven't got that far into

I haven't got that far into the 2E book so can't comment on that. I am curious though.

However, an idea I had back in 1E was for quickly printed biomorphs. To make the cells to survive the printing process, it would include hibernation, medichines, and respirocytes mods. I felt the need to compensate (since quickly made biomorphs are not a thing), so these quickly printed biomorphs often had some neurological and/or physical defects. I never finished the idea.

Edit: I'm also curious as to the quality of the hardware used to grow biomorphs. Do you use a healing vat for every biomorph; zygote to adult? Or do they use something less powerful? If something less powerful is used, then could a healing vat grow a morph faster?

Xagroth Xagroth's picture
Considering how things are in

Considering how things are in EP, a simple answer is to use a beta fork for babysit one or several bodies.

Also, once the model is "standarized" enough, I'd bet you can use dumb drones for this babysitting, so if anomalies are detected an expert can be called.

Decivre Decivre's picture
Xagroth is right; ALI are

Xagroth is right; ALI are likely essential to the process of exowomb development. My guess is that since an exowomb isn't a living person's body, an actual person has to make the necessary hormone and nutrient adjustments that would naturally occur as a result of an expecting mother simply living her life. An ALI can in theory automate that with the right skills, but otherwise it is likely something that requires attention.

Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age.

Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.

Archivist Archivist's picture
Consider the amount of

Consider the amount of “clanking masses” trapped in cheap sythmorphs, it must be pretty hard.

If not then there’ll be little point to improve the case morph. Surely no hypercorp can copyright the genes for a baseline human.

Xagroth Xagroth's picture
Archivist wrote:Consider the

Archivist wrote:
Consider the amount of “clanking masses” trapped in cheap sythmorphs, it must be pretty hard.

If not then there’ll be little point to improve the case morph. Surely no hypercorp can copyright the genes for a baseline human.

Yes and no. We see in almost every book, regardless of it being rules, adventure or fluff, how so many throw away biomorphs like useless toys. Fights to the death are popular sports, etc...

On the other hand, one who has just went out of indentured work might grab a case and go with it (I see little reason to sleeve into a case, instead of being an infomorph jamming said case while residing in it), in order to limit their relationships with the corps which just released they, since while I doubt the Hypercorps try to keep everybody eternally indentured (seriously, it's hard to practice capitalism when only the rich have money and there is nothing to spend it into aside other rich people), i'd bet their "company trap" is to release said indentures with the bare minimum amount of resources, and if they want a fancy body, they have to sign up for more (now as a worker with a mortgage: a client).

So yeah, printing a synthmorph for consumer use is fast and cheap and automated. Making a splicer biomorph more quickly and efficiently would turn their value down, thus making people not as interested into getting the new and fancy biomorph...
The way I see it, is kinda like the car industry: they have the next ten years of bells and whistles ready, but not in production so people want to update their models. Translated to EP, you want to go from pedestrian (infomorph) to basic car (splicer, rust, etc...).

As for the flat genes... I'd bet people have sold their genome code to a hypercorp for some reason (desperation, for one thing). Making splicers that are not all clones of the same genome can be done either by creating the genome from scratch, or from varied genetic material... so in-womb reproduction is possible, that makes new customers after all (a child who owes their body...).

icefyer0 icefyer0's picture
Quote:Yes and no. We see in

Quote:
Yes and no. We see in almost every book, regardless of it being rules, adventure or fluff, how so many throw away biomorphs like useless toys. Fights to the death are popular sports, etc...

Well, thing is, you can slap a recently-dead body into the healing vat and revive it. Even if all that survives is a head you can pop it in and 'recycle' the body, so unless the body was absolutely splattered or incinerated it can be recovered, and even decapitation won't kill you, at least not as long as you have medichines or something to put the head in stasis.

Xagroth Xagroth's picture
icefyer0 wrote:Quote:Yes and

icefyer0 wrote:
Quote:
Yes and no. We see in almost every book, regardless of it being rules, adventure or fluff, how so many throw away biomorphs like useless toys. Fights to the death are popular sports, etc...

Well, thing is, you can slap a recently-dead body into the healing vat and revive it. Even if all that survives is a head you can pop it in and 'recycle' the body, so unless the body was absolutely splattered or incinerated it can be recovered, and even decapitation won't kill you, at least not as long as you have medichines or something to put the head in stasis.

The target here would be to recover the body to a usable state, not the ego (which survives due to cortical stack... there were rules for head preservation and such, but that were because, well, earth adventures and Jovian "prisioners").

I don't think you can get a body from dead to alive as easily as you can print a new morph, frankly... mostly because of the amount of punishment bodies with things like medichimes can take, it's like a professional sportsman: once they reach the limit, there is no going further (like people without training can do), because their limits are already at the limit...
In this case, a morph would cross from operative to totally death in a single step.

eaton eaton's picture
In the world of EP, it feels

In the world of EP, it feels like bodies are a good analogue for modern humanity's automobiles.

In large swaths of the world (or in marginalized parts of wealthy polities) many people make do with "beaters" or nothing at all. If they don't have one, they rely on public resources, loaners and assistance from associates, or renting in emergencies. If they do have one, keeping it in good shape is a matter of survival. Getting a brand new high-end one is something that happens in entertainment videos, not something that's reasonably within reach.

For the well-to-do in most of the world, or the middle class in wealthy polities, they're an assumed part of living but they're also a huge expense — so much so that most people go into debt to get one, working off the cost over the course of five or more years. If it's wrecked, or gives out before they've paid off the loan? They rely on insurance to replace it and still have to swallow painful expenses. Without that safety net they'd be SOL. When they travel, they might rent a a high-end one as a treat.

Some people — either because of personal taste, or because they live in densely-packed areas where it's more hassle than they feel it's worth — prefer to live without them entirely.

For the wealthy, ownership is high and many have two or more — some even collect them, give shiny new ones to their children as gifts, and generally treat them as toys and status symbols rather than essential tools for work and living. Thanks to their wealth, cars are assets to be owned and enjoyed, and losing one is annoying — but not life-altering.

Viewed through those lenses, the average Firewall mission is the climax of The Fast And The Furious — a spectacle of destruction in which cars are a disposable resource to keep a team moving towards their goal. In the background, though, there's still the poor schmoe trying to pay off his Camry and praying to god the brakes don't go out because he'll lose his job if he can't commute.

Scottbert Scottbert's picture
eaton wrote:In the world of

eaton wrote:
In the world of EP, it feels like bodies are a good analogue for modern humanity's automobiles.

....


Wow, this seems spot on. Good analogy!

I still wonder whether cloning vats need eight hours of babysitting a day, though...

ubik2 ubik2's picture
If you're content with a 70%

If you're content with a 70% success rate, you could have the ALI (with appropriate specialization) handle it. RAW, that would also take 1/3rd the listed time, since the ALI can run 24 hours a day. I'm not sure if that's RAI. Using the taking time rule, the ALI can get even a lesser skill of 40 up to 100 by taking 2.5x as long (likely skipping the skill test). The combination of these two means that for the listed time, you can just assume you get the morph without any player skill test. If the player focuses on the task, you can make the rolls, and divide the time by 3.

Xagroth Xagroth's picture
ubik2 wrote:If you're content

ubik2 wrote:
If you're content with a 70% success rate, you could have the ALI (with appropriate specialization) handle it. RAW, that would also take 1/3rd the listed time, since the ALI can run 24 hours a day. I'm not sure if that's RAI. Using the taking time rule, the ALI can get even a lesser skill of 40 up to 100 by taking 2.5x as long (likely skipping the skill test). The combination of these two means that for the listed time, you can just assume you get the morph without any player skill test. If the player focuses on the task, you can make the rolls, and divide the time by 3.

Gaming the system could, in theory, get the production of a biomorph down to weeks, by using grouping, forking, accelerated simulspace...

I think, however, that the biomorph & pod production is at its maximum efficiency given transhumanity's current technological level, also giving a better excuse to scarcity than "because the game system says so".