Average ages.

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genmaes genmaes's picture
Average ages.

Hiya everybody.

This is my first post here. I´m from Spain and my english is quite bad so sorry about that.

My first question is about the range of ages that we can find in the transhumans people. How old can be a transhuman in the moment of the game? I mean 10 years after the fall.

I see than 60 years Before fall it is said that we have great health advances ok so maybe people could reach 100 years easely and the top cold be at 120 or 130 years old

In BF 60-40 we have genetic enchancements, and gene therapies for longevity, but only for the welthy so the average people cold be in the same 100 years +/- 10 and the wealthy maybe we can find people about 150 not too much and not too many people.

BF 40-20 first trashuman (then only for the wealthy ones)

BF 20- Transhumans become widespread (Ok but not all the elders will be prone to change their bodys)

So maybe we can find 10 years after the fall many people that can be arround 50 - 80. Some about 100 years old, a few could be at 130 - 140 years old and a very little 160 - 170 years old. That number could be increase if we find a rich one that could be maybe in 200 - 220 years old but very very little (That sopuses that he/she was 130 - 150 in BF 60).

Maybe I'm wrong. Please tell me your thoughts.

PS. Of course I understand that shold be many more people younger than that age. In another post I will ask about upbringing and Childhood

Marek Krysiak Marek Krysiak's picture
Re: Average ages.

Hi, ganmaes.
Welcome to our cozy little forum.

As far as I can tell, your calculations seem to be pretty accurate. Remember that there are also a lot of people (well... beings) created shortly before or shortly after the Fall, such as: uplifts, AIs, alpha-forks - those might or might not be considered "persons", (depending on what legislation you live in) but they _are_ numerous.
But that's pretty much what you said in your PS, right?


genmaes genmaes's picture
Re: Average ages.

Yea yea thats more or less what I mean with the youngsters. I thought maybe those ones between 20 to 70 more os less. I'm a little bit Jovian into consider AIs, uplifts and all of thoses to be human but I know that they are there. Anyway you say that can be numerous, but If the fall was only ten years ago I supoused that mainly in the inner sistem (nothing to say with the jovian) they should be really controled and limited, isn't it?

Thanks for such a fast answers.

Marek Krysiak Marek Krysiak's picture
Re: Average ages.

I think it's mostly dependent on population - you know: how many people live under which legislation. There's this great and very informative map by Kindalas: http://www.eclipsephase.com/solar-system-map-scaled-population-density

You can see that the most heavilly populated systems are: Jupiter (super-conservative), Mars (quite conservative), Luna (slightly less conservative), and Titan (even less conservative). So majority of transhumanity still lives in places, where artificials and uplifts are not considered equal.

But then there are places such as Locus (which also orbits around Jupiter...), to screw with my reasoning.

And one more thing - number of those young transhumans _will_ grow, and will grow fast. Forking, cloning, AI development, - those things happen all the time: in outer system, in more isolated places, or even right under Junta's nose.
The world of Eclipse Phase is not a static one. It will change.


Xagroth Xagroth's picture
Re: Average ages.

I'm from Spain too, if you have some doubt regarding the language, don't doubt to ask (via thread or PM) :)

As for considering Forks "human beings"... I hope your character won't be killed in a situation that the recovery of the Cortical Stack is not possible (or economic ^^). Since, you know, a backup is an alpha fork... considered "original" because it is *usually* activated when the original is dead (or he was hidden for more than 6 months...) :p

An "imaginative" GM might face you with an original, while your character is a backup activated after such an event... oh dear... XD

genmaes genmaes's picture
Re: Average ages.

I see, I see Marek, thanks and thanks for the link to the map, great resource.

Thanks Xagrot (muchas gracias caballero) Its great to see Spanish people folowing this great game.

Ok lets continous then.

My next question also related with age too, this one is about upbringing and childhood.

Ok It is suposed that we are having childrens in the traditional way isn't it? More if we think about the lost generation, so I have many doubs related with the children.

1. The children from flats or not flat morphs are usually genetic modified (avoiding radical bioconservatives) to look healthier, faster, etc. isn´t it?

2. They have normal growing to avoid mental problems (as a Psicologyst I can say that this seams prety close to reality), but there we have some problems wich age could be considerar legal to change your biomorph 18? or just when you start to work? There is any kind of legislation to avoid teens to change bodys specialy taking elders ones? When they are old enoght then they use their morph as their usual morph or just that one that you grow with it.

3. Legislation or identification to avoid that a monster using a Morph lookslike a child or the other way a child that sais that is an adult in a morph that looks as a child. Horrible I know, but that thing could hapen.

Thanks so much.

LeZero LeZero's picture
Re: Average ages.

I have a question too about children, because in the manga serie Gunnm Last Order, due to the nano-tech of the Methuselyzation that stop the body's aging, the children are forbidden and are killed.
Is there something like that in Eclipse Phase? Because, people can virtually live forever, so if they continue to have children, there will be an unstoppable population increase.
And after all, are people still wanting children?

Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture
Re: Average ages.

Remember, transhumanity almost got wiped out ten years ago. Having more people would be a very good thing, according to most polities. Hence things like the Lost Generation project.

Before the fall overpopulation was likely a concern in some places. But just like in real life it is not a simple issue. It is rarely too many people that is the problem, but that they are too poor. Many places suffered from underpopulation or aged populations, and life extension would be necessary to balance this and keep the economy moving (if you cannot get or accept immigration, of course). When few people have kids, it is actually harder, more expensive and less likely that you will have kids (the UN predictions of long-term convergence to 2.1 fertility are largely based on wishful thinking - fertility can change a lot due to culture and economics). Some places had little or no law (think autonomists) and regulating fertility would be tricky. Other places were hypercorp-run and might have had various nativity policies - from sponsored exowombs and excellent childcare to sterile morphs. In short, all over the place.

After the Fall the big issue was living space and morphs. Some habitats do have resource constraints and cannot have too many morphs around (hence the neotenics), so people might not be allowed to have non-synthmorph children. But a lot of places want to expand (as well respond to the nasty brush with mortality) and might be very pro-children. The Jovian Republic is clearly in this camp (despite resource problems) for ideological reasons: there must be more natural humans around.

(As for how people have children, please check the earlier threads about it - there are literally dozens of threads around: the transhuman birds and bees (and mercurial storks) seem to be endlessly fascinating for some reason)

Extropian

Marek Krysiak Marek Krysiak's picture
Re: Average ages.

Quote:
1. The children from flats or not flat morphs are usually genetic modified (avoiding radical bioconservatives) to look healthier, faster, etc. isn´t it?

Well, not exactly: flats are not modified. They are normal Homo sapiens sapiens, just like us - genomes full of mutations, bodies vulnerable to diseases, and hairy calves.
All other morphs are modified in some ways - be it small modifications in Splicers, or total overhaul in Remades.

Quote:
2. They have normal growing to avoid mental problems (as a Psicologyst I can say that this seams prety close to reality), but there we have some problems wich age could be considerar legal to change your biomorph 18? or just when you start to work? There is any kind of legislation to avoid teens to change bodys specialy taking elders ones? When they are old enoght then they use their morph as their usual morph or just that one that you grow with it.

I think it depends on habitat in question, but I'd say that in most places it would be quite difficult for a teenager to even acquire a second morph - they are expensive and much sought after commodities. Young humans rarely possess enough resources - credits or reputation. Your family or peers may also strongly oppose your plans of body swapping, since it is a traumatizing process for any transhuman - and even more so for a child or a teen.
People also avoid changing morphs on regular basis - unless it's absolutely required for the work they do. Even if they do they require regular attention of a psychotherapist to help them cope with the experience.

Quote:
3. Legislation or identification to avoid that a monster using a Morph lookslike a child or the other way a child that sais that is an adult in a morph that looks as a child. Horrible I know, but that thing could hapen.

Your face and body are not a primary means of identification. You carry your mesh ID with you all the time - just like social network profile - and people around you can immediately access a whole lot of information about you - by both legal and illegal means. The whole system of Reputation Networks is based around the ability to instantly identify people and gather info about them.


genmaes genmaes's picture
Re: Average ages.

Thanks for all the answers all of them seems to be prety coherent.

For the birds and bees problems an easy, fast and probably you will say poor soloution is that every biomorph can have childrens mixing each other only with the help of a genetist that asure that the basic genetic code is from parents and the rest code lines just playing to be god, to avoid deseases an all the stuff.
Flats as usual. And nothing for sintomorph.

But if you want I think you have enought controversy to fullfill an entirely sesion about that.

See you.