3rd Printing: Synthmorphs, Armor, and Armor Mods

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Clunker Clunker's picture
3rd Printing: Synthmorphs, Armor, and Armor Mods

OK, after hitting the Search function for a several pages worth of threads,
I still have to ask the following questions about Synthmorphs:

1) What is the current Max Armor stacking, if one does NOT want any Layering Penalties?

2) What is the current Max Armor stacking, if one is ok with any Layering Penalties?

3) How many Armor Mods can a particular 'armor' have?
I've seen mention post 3rd Printing that Smart Vac Clothing can get to 23+...
(How? Aren't you limited to One Mod of each Mod Type per Armor?)

I'm under the idea with the idea that "Robotic Enhancements" armor types cannot
be stacked with armor that counts for wearable/layering penalties due to the "not
compatible with worn armor" (IE: Body Armor (Heavy) would not work,
while Smart Skin would).

(But Robotic Enhancement also states that such armor increases one's
Built-In Armor rating, & one normally CAN add 'wearable' armor to such...
bwuh?)

I do understand that one's Maximum is limited to current morph "Durability";
now, is that based upon post-enhancments Durability, or the 'base' durability
one has from the 'standard' version of said morph?

Really, I'd like it if someone could step-walk me through making the
heaviest-armored up tank of a morph, but as by-the-book as possible,
so that I can both see how to maximize it, and to be able to dissuade
players from going over that, due to my misunderstanding.

It seems that Synthmorphs have a harder time Armor Stacking, once they
use a Robotic Enhancement armor...

One thing - can a PC with a synthmorph take "Tough" Positive Trait?
If so, wouldn't that radically jump-up one's Durabilty/Armor Limit?

And how does one get a morph (any kind) with a Postive Trait after chargen?
Can one design such traits with Hardware or Medical: Biosculpting?

UnitOmega UnitOmega's picture
Re: 3rd Printing: Synthmorphs, Armor, and Armor Mods

Clunker wrote:
OK, after hitting the Search function for a several pages worth of threads,
I still have to ask the following questions about Synthmorphs:

1) What is the current Max Armor stacking, if one does NOT want any Layering Penalties?

2) What is the current Max Armor stacking, if one is ok with any Layering Penalties?

3) How many Armor Mods can a particular 'armor' have?
I've seen mention post 3rd Printing that Smart Vac Clothing can get to 23+...
(How? Aren't you limited to One Mod of each Mod Type per Armor?)

1) Without layering penalties? Not doing the math for mods, that would be to have Bioweave (Heavy), and either an inactive crash suit or some armored clothing on under a Battlesuit. AV is 27/29. With a battlesuit you can wear armor with an AV of 4 or less while wearing the exoskeleton and that will stack without penalty.

2) It's a -20 for each layer of armor. How much of a chance to not do things do you want?

3) Doesn't say anything in Armor Mods about a limit, so as many as you can afford. I'm going to assume you can't double up a mod, though, because that would be nonsensical.

Clunker wrote:
I'm under the idea with the idea that "Robotic Enhancements" armor types cannot be stacked
with armor that counts for wearable/layering penalties due to the "not compatible with worn
armor" (IE: Body Armor (Heavy) would not work, while Smart Skin would).

(But Robotic Enhancement also states that such armor increases one's Built-In Armor rating,
and one normally CAN add 'wearable' armor to such... bwuh?)

I do understand that one's Maximum is limited to current morph "Durability";
now, is that based upon post-enhancments Durability, or the 'base' durability one has from
the 'standard' version of said morph?

If you buy an Armor Enhancement, the synthmorph cannot wear armor without penalty. The armor stacks with the existing armor the synthmorph's body has, without penalty, because that's like bioweave for bimorphs. I'm going to assume by Durability, it means Durability. If you have more, you can have more armor. Makes sense.

Quote:
Really, I'd like it if someone could step-walk me through making the heaviest-armored up
tank of a morph, but as by-the-book as possible, so that I can both see how to maximize it,
and to be able to dissuade players from going over that, due to my misunderstanding.

It seems that Synthmorphs have a harder time Armor Stacking, once they use a
Robotic Enhancement armor...

A Reaper Synthmorph starts with 16/16 and can double that with Heavy Combat Armor enhancement for 32/32, not counting the mods. Buuuut Reapers are floating tanks, and probably not allows in most habs on the Inner System. And some out. for fleshies, Bioweave Armor (Heavy) 3/4, Crash Suit 3/4 (4/6 active, but you can't do that inside the battlesuit). Battlesuit 21/21. As mentioned, that's 27/29. Ablative patches to the Exo is +4/+2, but the armor's AV is reduced by 1 every hit. 31/31. Fireproofing is +2/+0, and 10 additional points of armor for fire or heat specifically. 33/31. Reactive Coating is +5/+5, but the wearer takes 1 point of damage for every attack, and it only holds 5 charges, then needs to replenish. 38/36 Finally, refractive glazing is +3/+0. 41/36 You'll need either a Ghost or a Fury morph to have high enough durability to wear that much armor. Or something a little lower and buy a couple implants.

Quote:
One thing - can a PC with a synthmorph take "Tough" Positive Trait? If so, wouldn't that
radically jump-up one's Durabilty/Armor Limit?

Unless it says otherwise under the Tough trait, yes.

Quote:
And how does one get a morph (any kind) with a Postive Trait after chargen?
Can one design such traits with Hardware or Medical: Biosculpting?

Err, maybe, with a Medicine: Biosculpting or Gene Therapy. But only for a Morph trait. (Most traits count as Ego traits). Normally, I'd just make them spend Rez. RP is a 1 for 1 to CP from the character gen.

H-Rep: An EP Homebrew Blog
http://ephrep.blogspot.com/

Clunker Clunker's picture
Re: 3rd Printing: Synthmorphs, Armor, and Armor Mods

Finally, an answer!

2) Here, I should have said more clearly what limits - I'm looking for Max Armor,
Max Layering Penalties; I think one is limited to -60 at most, yes?

On the "Durability" thing - I was not entirely sure if one should count
'off-the-shelf' durability, or the amount one has AFTER purchasing
Enhancements; thanks for clarifying that it refers to 'final Durability'.

Thanks also for 'doing the math' on Reaper vs. Biomorph options;
it looks like I did indeed have the right idea after all
- I'd come to the same AV endpoints.

Last bit about "Tough" Trait - Ok, so using Medicine: Biosculpting
to 'grow/design' a morph that has the "Tough" Trait inherently sounds feasible?

Technically, one should be able the same for Synthmorphs using
Hardware: Robotics it seems, as "Tough" is not limited to just Bio-morphs
or Pods...

So I must have misread a post, where'd someone got to 23 AV
with a Smart Vacsuit; I am of the same mind that adding multiple
instances of the same Armor Mod is...
unworkable.

Thanks for the help so far!

crizh crizh's picture
Did I miss an errata?

Heavy Combat Armor: The synthmorph’s frame
is loaded with armor that offers protection from
heavy weapons for serious combat operations. This
modification is bulky and noticeable; the bot frame
is encased in a heavy-duty carapace. It increases the
bot’s built-in Armor to 16/16.

I keep seeing people talking about Reapers with Heavy Combat Armour and I'm pretty sure you can't do that.

Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.

Tyrnis Tyrnis's picture
Yes, you missed errata,

Yes, you missed errata, though I don't remember now if that was part of the 2nd or 3rd printing errata. Synthmorph armor stacks with the built in armor of the morph, so a reaper with heavy combat armor is 32/32.

Eclipse Phase (3rd), page 310:

Armor
These armor modifications add to the synthmorph’s built-in Armor rating. They are not compatible with worn armor.

CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
It is generally considered an

It is generally considered an oversight. When the errata was being discussed, there was a very specific example which had the Reaper getting 32/32 armour by adding the heavy armour mod. The trouble is that they aren't particularly consistent with it. You can play it either way really.

-

crizh crizh's picture
Tyrnis wrote:Yes, you missed

Tyrnis wrote:
Yes, you missed errata, though I don't remember now if that was part of the 2nd or 3rd printing errata. Synthmorph armor stacks with the built in armor of the morph, so a reaper with heavy combat armor is 32/32.

Eclipse Phase (3rd), page 310:

Armor
These armor modifications add to the synthmorph’s built-in Armor rating. They are not compatible with worn armor.

Yes, I saw the same text (I am using the third printing) but was forced to come to the conclusion that the two quotes are not incompatible. If you apply Industrial Armour to a Case its armour becomes 10/10. We have clearly 'added' to its built in armour value.

I'm afraid that I wasn't really paying attention to this issue in the errata thread, I was more wrapped up in the Blackjack discussion. I may have started to become conscious of people using it wrong at that point but I don't remember. I have definitely become more and more conscious over time of folks talking about this mythical 32/32 Reaper.

As it stands either it doesn't stack with built in armour or the text is unusably inconsistent.

Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.